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Lily Hammer 10:36 Wed Oct 25
Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Genuine questions to our posters old enough to remember, but when we were relegated under John Lyall in 1978: Did we look clueless and disorganised? Were the players putting in effort, but just being unlucky for a whole season? Or were they being spineless and complacent? Were the fans blaming teh manager or the player or the owners?

I was too young to remember the style of play or level of performance, but, as amazing as it was that a manager could keep his job in those days after relegation, I wonder how he managed to turn around the club from going down, to winning the cup, promotion, and tehn a few years after, nearly winning the league.

What went wrong in the 77/78 season?

On The Ball 10:40 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

If the internet/messageboards/Twitter etc was around then, he'd have been crucified.

di_kezio 10:43 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

I've been wondering the same thing this week. Have seen a couple of posts mentioning that relegation, and I wondered how he managed to hang on to the job.

Dr Moose 10:51 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

di_kezio 10:43 Wed Oct 25

Back then relegation wasn't the financial nightmare for clubs as it is today, you didn't have the players on extortionate money so the club could afford to be in the lower division for a season or two.

Eggbert Nobacon 10:52 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

the second time round Lyall had 18 months to 2 years of abuse far worse than I've seen any other manager get over there

MancIron 10:53 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Completely different times, so difficult to compare.

Remember that Brooking who was probably the 2nd or 3rd name down on the England team sheet at that time stuck with us throughout our 3 seasons in the 2nd division. A player of his talent wouldn't even linger at a mid-table Prem club now.

Wasn't the massive differences in TV money either, basically the clubs were funded by the number of people coming through the turnstiles.

Think we finished 5th in the first season down, the following season we won the FA Cup and reached the quarter finals of the League Cup. And, of course, we were promoted we did it in fucking great style. Still my favourite season ever.

MancIron 10:56 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

*when* we were promoted

Trevor B 10:59 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

I don't remember it that well but as others have said it was completely different back then, there wasn't the expectation from the fans nor the board and it wasn't deemed a disaster if you got relegated, certainly not in monetary terms anyway. Managers weren't routinely dismissed after a poor season, let alone 8 games or so.

Hasans Fish Bar RIP 11:01 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

It wasn't IMHO the 'catastrophe' that it is to be relegated these days *sky camera pans round to crying twat with "we'll be back" sign*. The financial implications were negligible too. I was only a young kid back then so I wasn't that bothered. Older ones on here may feel different. As OtB said he would have been cunted off if WHO was around then. Fast forward 10 years later though I vividly remember the lyall out change. That wasn't a small minority either

twoleftfeet 11:02 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

The season we were relegated we were dreadful, the football we played was poorer than this season by far but as other posters have stated we lived in different times.

These days Lyall would have been hounded non stop by the media and all of the social media sites until he resigned or was sacked but our board was never one for sacking a manager and that paid dividends eventually.

People shit themselves over relegation these days but then it didn’t make a big difference, the crowds were still big and that was all that mattered. All this TV money changed everything.

On The Ball 11:05 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

People were less knee-jerk and panicky then. There was less money at stake which might be a factor.

Biggie Biggs 11:06 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

we finished 5th and 7th in the old division 2 with Brooking , Devonshire , Bonds and Parkes , i imagine nowadays the manager would have been lucky to last through the first season in the second division

twoleftfeet 11:08 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

There was never a need to make 11 changes for a League Cup Match, if you played on the Saturday and won then you played away to Crewe on the Wednesday in the cup. Simple as that.

Sven Roeder 11:09 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Can you imagine a Championship side these days with Brooking, Devonshire, Bonds, Stewart, Parkes, Martin etc?

twoleftfeet 11:09 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Four players of their abilities would today have their agents knocking on the managers door the day after relegation asking to leave.

As we have said, different, better times.

On The Ball 11:12 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Sven - no, they're far too old.


swt

Syd Puddefoot 11:44 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

As far as I recall it was just as painful on the field and the original and best Fanzine “Fortunes” was primarily concerned with discretely & subtlety pointing out to the manager where he was going wrong. Check out some back numbers for a flavour of the times, I think they are online somewhere.

Northern Sold 11:47 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Reply Eggbert Nobacon 10:52 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall
the second time round Lyall had 18 months to 2 years of abuse far worse than I've seen any other manager get over there


Agree Eggy... it was shameful... what I can remember he got far far more stick 2nd time round... the Lyall Out chants broke my heart... compared to the easy ride that cunt Allardyce got from us... I just think Apathy has set in now in modern football.. everyone just shrugs the shoulders now and pisses off 10 mins early.. different times and different breed... what I remember about the football (I was 10 /11 years old) I thought it was no different to a lot of the other years... !! As someone had stated... all that brilliance under Lyall in the 80's would never have happened now... he'd been gone in a flash

zico 12:00 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

I was and still am a big John Lyall fan although I can certainly remember hearing some pretty savage vitriol against him which I thought unfair. Personally the big difference between him and Bilic IMO is that Lyall always seemed to have a philosophy whereas Slaven just seems to have no idea what he is doing.

78 there were players that were suffering with loss of form or confidence and some injuries. Mervyn Day had lost it and Alan Taylor was a one season wonder so the team needed rebuilding which John did by bringing in Phil Parkes and the likes of Alvin, Ray Stewart, David Cross and Stuart Pearson.

88 For whatever reason he didn't bring in quality players to kick on after the 85/86 season. These days Paul Goddard would have been told to fight for his place but was allowed to leave leaving us with Cottee and McAvennie who both left leaving us with not much up top. People rave about Stewart Robson but I don't think he was a West Ham type of player. He just wanted to do it all.

I still reckon that John would have rebuilt or at the very least should have been offered a move "upstairs".

Northern Sold 12:04 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

Pretty sure we went down with Pop Robson up front as well... IIRC he scored a hatful that 1st season in div 2... and we still never got promoted...

Northern Sold 12:07 Wed Oct 25
Re: Questions For Older Posters About Relegation Under Lyall

http://www.westhamstats.info/westham.php?west=4&ham=1979&united=2nd_Division_1978-79

26 Fucking goals.... Blimey... on top of Cross's 18.... and we came fifth!!

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